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Porsche's Entry-Level Roadster Delayed

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  • #16
    Originally posted by bellwilliam View Post
    just like why latest Mustang didn't go to IRS. they risk alienating their loyal customer base.
    for 911 to go mid-engine, it is called Cayman.
    don't forget many like their 911, because it is a "4 seater". for someone who has kids, it makes a big difference. I can't think of another mainstream sports car that has rear seats. no matter how small the rear seats are, just being a "4 seater" makes it much easier to sell to wives.

    golden rule in business - don't fix it if it aint broken.....
    In the case of the Mustang, there are manufacturing costs to consider. Live axles are cheaper than IRS, and it's likely that Ford doesn't want to price the Mustang higher than most people are willing to pay ... for a Mustang. The last Fox-body 'stangs used IRS in the Cobra, but all other models were still equipped with a live axle on coils.

    With Porsche, it's still a matter of the 911 being the halo car. The Carrera didn't usurp the 911's reign as Porsche's mainstay because it was priced so that it could never sell in the numbers the 911 does. And Porsche will not make the Cayman faster, on purpose, as has been pointed out already. It might be a German thing, too.

    For example, at BMW motorcycles, the opposed boxer twin just won't go away even though there are superior engine designs for motorcycles. It was just in last few years that BMW finally put an upright DOHC four-cylinder with chain drive in its sport bikes instead of some dopey flat three-cylinder and a shaft drive. Nonetheless, the boxer twin lives on.
    www.TrackHQ.com

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    • #17
      you could also use Harley as an example. no matter how crappy V-Twin is, no matter how riced out they are. They will stick with it, because that's a Harley...
      S1 Supermiata - 220whp
      13 Tesla, ma: no engine !!
      17 GT350R
      03 Miata Club Sport
      96 NSX
      06 EVO MR
      15 Mini Cooper S
      Beck 550 Spyder

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      • #18
        Originally posted by bellwilliam View Post
        you could also use Harley as an example. no matter how crappy V-Twin is, no matter how riced out they are. They will stick with it, because that's a Harley...
        Another good analogy. Oddly enough, Harley did add the V Rod to its product portfolio, but it doesn't sell nearly as well as its other models. It's a new design, water-cooled OHC V-twin engine that it co-developed with—wait for it, wait for it—Porsche.
        www.TrackHQ.com

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        • #19
          The 911 is now a symbol of prestige. Most never see a race track. It's probably the most recognized sports car out there.
          Elise
          MR2 Spyder
          Mazda RX7 FD
          Porsche 911E

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          • #20
            Obviously moving the engine would be bad, but I can't imagine any Porsche enthusiast crying if the McPherson struts were replaced with wishbones/sla, especially when the Cayman and Boxster use them.

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            • #21
              I thought Cayman/boxster were Macstrut in the front.
              Elise
              MR2 Spyder
              Mazda RX7 FD
              Porsche 911E

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              • #22
                I could be (see 'probably am') wrong.

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                • #23
                  They tried that with the 928. The 928 was supposed to replace the 911, and at the time was raved about for how great it was (now most consider it to be a pile). This was nearly the end for Porsche. The concept of slowing down your lower tier products is nothing new or exclusive to Porsche. Look at the 335/135 and the M3. Both were detuned so they didn't compete with the M3. From a marketing and business standpoint this makes perfect sense.
                  I also don't understand your fundamentally wrong issue. The 911 is the most successful sports car in racing history and its street cars are just as impressive. The GT3RS is considered to be one of the best drivers car available. I've had the opportunity to drive some very nice and fast cars and the GT3RS is hands down my favorite. It was raw, responsive, and felt incredible (as it should for that price). The 991 is supposed to be even better and I'm sure the 991 GT3/RS and GT2 will be just as good.
                  I understand saying you don't like Porsche or the 911, but to say they're doing something wrong seems to disagree with their racing history. Both the PCA and POC have many driving events where you can find tons of Porsches from every generation out. Obviously the majority are not driven hard, but many of the drivers do use them for what they were made for.
                  Last edited by 5:04; 01-18-2012, 06:20 PM.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by 5:04 View Post
                    .. The 911 is the most successful sports car in racing history and its street cars are just as impressive.
                    Porsche wins races with 911's despite their engine placement, not because of it. They simply out engineer and out spend everyone else. Are pushrod engines and carburetors inherently superior because NASCAR goes 220mph in sedans with them? Wake up and smell the marketing dude.
                    WWW.949RACING.COM
                    SuperMiata

                    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
                    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

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                    • #25
                      Emilio is spot in IMO. People often cite the GT3 RS. There's no denying the car is great, but since a full-effort GT3 version of the Cayman doesn't exist, there's no apples to apples comparison. Driver's perspective: I've also heard from a handful of 911 owners (that also own mid-engined cars) that they find the rear-engined dynamics challenging to master and thus rewarding.
                      '05 Lotus Elise
                      '16 Porsche Cayman GT4

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                      • #26
                        Well this sums it up quite nicely. Porsche will never abandon its heritage, and challenge everything in order to preserve its identity, keeping the 911 atop as its flagship.

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                        • #27
                          When you watch this video and read the news story in the original post, the so-called worry that an entry-level roadster would "dilute the brand's image" makes even less sense. There was not one Cayenne shown in the video, but lots of 356s and 550s.
                          www.TrackHQ.com

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                          • #28
                            Granted the Cayenne and Panamera are not in tune with the rest of porsche's image, but they are still upmarket of what most people can (or are willing) to afford. I am not saying Porsche is making any sense, but bringing a sub 40k car with their emblem on it, might be a detriment to their intended client base.

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                            • #29
                              I agree with Emillio, marketing and therefore money is what makes the decisions. The video does sum it up. Porsche is unique and the arse end engine adds to that uniqueness, identity and tradition. Their marketing plays on and takes advantage of it in a very big way. Reviews frequently say the engineering is exceptional and the car is fantastic in spite of the engine being in the wrong place.

                              I think Porsche is an exceptional company and like Emillio I have think that what I want most is to see what those amazingly talented engineers could do if they were given the go ahead with a completely clean slate. A modern day version of the 550.

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